New MSX core In The Works

molekula
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New MSX core In The Works

Unread post by molekula »

@vanfanel

Coming soon. I based this on the documentation https://www.msx.org/wiki/Philips_VG-8010

https://youtu.be/DrBftyc9LSs
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Re: Sord M5 (Japanese Computer)

Unread post by wark91 »

Thank you @molekula it will help a lot for MSX 1 experience of gaming.
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Re: Sord M5 (Japanese Computer)

Unread post by neurorulez »

Thanx for the pure MSX core. VG-8020 is my MSX machine, The brother of your specs but with 64KB RAM in slot 3 if you wanna use more ram :D .

https://www.msx.org/wiki/Philips_VG-8020
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Re: Sord M5 (Japanese Computer)

Unread post by vampier »

Looks great already. How did you get around all the different kind of mappers?

If needed I can help testing or provide mapper types if needed:

https://romdb.vampier.net/Archive//soft ... latest.zip

This zip file contains the Official XML ROM database for openMSX as well as a SQLLite file

I hope the MSX will run at 60hz to make sure most games run at the correct speed.
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Re: Sord M5 (Japanese Computer)

Unread post by NinjaWarrior »

vampier wrote: Fri Dec 31, 2021 2:40 pm I hope the MSX will run at 60hz to make sure most games run at the correct speed.
While 60hz is desirable for japanese titles, I think the problem we have right now regarding compatibility is 50hz PAL games, so I think an Euro machine implementation would be a great in order to recreate the original PAL MSX1 computers, whose are now not preserved as they should. So a 50/60Hz selectable option in OSD (not by software like OCM) is a neat feature to add if possible, of course.

I can help also with tests.
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Re: Sord M5 (Japanese Computer)

Unread post by Pepeart »

I have a question regarding the sord m5, since I use a crt tv NTSC, is there a way to run the core NTSC mode? Thank you
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Re: Sord M5 (Japanese Computer)

Unread post by molekula »

vampier wrote: Fri Dec 31, 2021 2:40 pm Looks great already. How did you get around all the different kind of mappers?

If needed I can help testing or provide mapper types if needed:

https://romdb.vampier.net/Archive//soft ... latest.zip

This zip file contains the Official XML ROM database for openMSX as well as a SQLLite file

I hope the MSX will run at 60hz to make sure most games run at the correct speed.
Memory handling is now handled according to the MSX1 standard. At least I hope so. If the ROM cartridge contains a custom mapper, I don't address it. I also haven't yet addressed what address to load the ROM from, and I load it to a fixed address. In the future, I hope to be able to determine the location of the ROM in memory and the type of mapper from the contents of the ROM using heuristics.

Thanks for the database, I will definitely study it.
NinjaWarrior wrote: Fri Dec 31, 2021 7:41 pm
vampier wrote: Fri Dec 31, 2021 2:40 pm I hope the MSX will run at 60hz to make sure most games run at the correct speed.
While 60hz is desirable for japanese titles, I think the problem we have right now regarding compatibility is 50hz PAL games, so I think an Euro machine implementation would be a great in order to recreate the original PAL MSX1 computers, whose are now not preserved as they should. So a 50/60Hz selectable option in OSD (not by software like OCM) is a neat feature to add if possible, of course.

I can help also with tests.
At the moment the frequency is determined by the SW configuration of the video processor and without the possibility to change it.
PAL - 50Hz
NTSC 60Hz.
I don't think adjusting the NTSC/PAL switching will be difficult, but it will be a bios problem. I assume the BIOS has to be aligned with the interrupt frequency.
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Re: Sord M5 (Japanese Computer)

Unread post by NinjaWarrior »

molekula wrote: Sun Jan 02, 2022 7:57 pm At the moment the frequency is determined by the SW configuration of the video processor and without the possibility to change it.
PAL - 50Hz
NTSC 60Hz.
I don't think adjusting the NTSC/PAL switching will be difficult, but it will be a bios problem. I assume the BIOS has to be aligned with the interrupt frequency.
Well, I think the first step is to implement a machine, not a "MSX" generic which is something we have already and, by my solely opinion, does not fulfill the task in machine preservation. Choosing a VG-8010 is a great idea (or best, a VG-8020) as the core will implement and preserve the machine itself, not a generic "MSX" with modern addons, which is far from a real machine implementation. So a PAL only machine is a good, very good start.
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Re: Sord M5 (Japanese Computer)

Unread post by akeley »

NinjaWarrior wrote: Mon Jan 03, 2022 11:32 am Well, I think the first step is to implement a machine, not a "MSX" generic which is something we have already and, by my solely opinion, does not fulfill the task in machine preservation. Choosing a VG-8010 is a great idea (or best, a VG-8020) as the core will implement and preserve the machine itself, not a generic "MSX" with modern addons, which is far from a real machine implementation. So a PAL only machine is a good, very good start.
I don't think it's necessary to "preserve" every single MSX machine model - after all, it was a generic standard, and all the manufacturers had to adhere to it to remain compatible. So it shouldn't really matter if you pick VG 8010 or some other machine, but it will definitely need 50 and 60 Hz and all the other intrinsics.

The main problem with the current implementation is that it lacks floppy/cart functionality and thus can't be really used like MSX without a flashcart, as it was back in the day.
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Re: Sord M5 (Japanese Computer)

Unread post by vampier »

akeley wrote: Mon Jan 03, 2022 1:40 pm
I don't think it's necessary to "preserve" every single MSX machine model - after all, it was a generic standard, and all the manufacturers had to adhere to it to remain compatible. So it shouldn't really matter if you pick VG 8010 or some other machine, but it will definitely need 50 and 60 Hz and all the other intrinsics.
We are already doing that with openMSX - and there are so many models. For MSX1 the Toshiba HX10 comes to mind over the Philips VG 8010 (Tandy) for no particular reason to be honest :) just preferences when I run MSX1 software.

As long as it supports SCC (Parodius/Salamander/Nemesis2 and 3/Kings Valley2) I'm fine. Disk (image) emulation would be nice as well.

The current OCM core has quite some quirks but is overall ok to play games on.
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Re: Sord M5 (Japanese Computer)

Unread post by akeley »

vampier wrote: Tue Jan 04, 2022 4:41 pm The current OCM core has quite some quirks but is overall ok to play games on.
Sure, it's okay for that ;) But it doesn't really give me that OG HW feel, like other cores where you can insert disks/carts/tapes and so on. Which is why I'd really love to see a dedicated core - it's just that it does not necessarily have to imitate a particular model to a T, in this case meaning that if there is an MSX PAL core based on VG-8010 in the works, it seems a small concession to also enable NTSC for it (even if it wasn't possible on the original machine).

Perhaps this topic would benefit from separate thread, to give good ol' Sord some breathing space.
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Re: Sord M5 (Japanese Computer)

Unread post by NinjaWarrior »

vampier wrote: Tue Jan 04, 2022 4:41 pm The current OCM core has quite some quirks but is overall ok to play games on.
It is ok to play games on, but that is not preservation. If I want to play games, I can launch retroarch->bluemsx core and play on any SoC, Pi, PC... but I think here we are talking about preserving a machine like it was in its original state, without modern "artifacts" (software, drivers or hardware). OCM Mister core relies on modern developments, like Nextor (and yes, I met Nestor Soriano many years ago and I really respect his fantastic work, but let put this into perspective, we still need a pure MSX machine implemented without sofaruns and such). And you are right, OCM has QUITE some quirks, and I found them unacceptable.
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Re: New MSX core In The Works

Unread post by vanfanel »

molekula wrote: Thu Dec 30, 2021 9:29 pm @vanfanel

Coming soon. I based this on the documentation https://www.msx.org/wiki/Philips_VG-8010

https://youtu.be/DrBftyc9LSs
How could I miss this thread for 5 DAYS!!!!??? Why oh why!!!

Thanks for this effort, I will follow this core veeeeery closely! At long last MSX is getting justice! :lol:
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wark91
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Re: New MSX core In The Works

Unread post by wark91 »

@NinjaWarrior, I will be more close to the real hardware and using a real bios.
To match completely we need to decap all chips not sure it will be the case.
Hopes we can combined also cartriges to unlock some special cases on Konami games not possible with current MSX core (OCM - 1chip msx)
https://gradius.fandom.com/wiki/Nemesis_2#Secrets
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Re: New MSX core In The Works

Unread post by molekula »

Hey,

I've posted the first publishable version. https://github.com/tdlabac/MSX1_MiSTer
Don't hit me too hard. I'm not a professional and I do this as a hobby. I never owned MSX, but I know ported games thanks to my Sord M5 :-).
There is also an rbf file available for download on github. BIOS is included. I ended up using a Philips VG-8020 as a template.
The ROM on the cartridge is supported up to 64 kB in size. There is no point in trying to load larger.
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Re: New MSX core In The Works

Unread post by ron »

molekula wrote: Wed Jan 05, 2022 10:33 pm Hey,

I've posted the first publishable version. https://github.com/tdlabac/MSX1_MiSTer
Don't hit me too hard. I'm not a professional and I do this as a hobby. I never owned MSX, but I know ported games thanks to my Sord M5 :-).
There is also an rbf file available for download on github. BIOS is included. I ended up using a Philips VG-8020 as a template.
The ROM on the cartridge is supported up to 64 kB in size. There is no point in trying to load larger.
Congrats Molekula, Already tested and very nice, very promissing... !
Cheers :D
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Re: New MSX core In The Works

Unread post by NinjaWarrior »

molekula wrote: Wed Jan 05, 2022 10:33 pm Hey,

I've posted the first publishable version. https://github.com/tdlabac/MSX1_MiSTer
Don't hit me too hard. I'm not a professional and I do this as a hobby. I never owned MSX, but I know ported games thanks to my Sord M5 :-).
There is also an rbf file available for download on github. BIOS is included. I ended up using a Philips VG-8020 as a template.
The ROM on the cartridge is supported up to 64 kB in size. There is no point in trying to load larger.
GREAT!! For a first release, it really looks very promising indeed. Fantastic work, thank you!
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Re: New MSX core In The Works

Unread post by wark91 »

Thank you !!!!
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Re: New MSX core In The Works

Unread post by Alkadian »

Thanks a lot!
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Re: New MSX core In The Works

Unread post by vampier »

I fired up the core - good 1st release and it runs most MSX1 games that don't utilize a memory mapper of some sort perfectly for the most part.

Does the core support audio in (loading from tape?)

I assume PSG is based on the YM2149 chip? Maybe you could piggyback on the PSG chips that are already out there that are compatible? https://www.msx.org/wiki/Category:PSG

Thanks! Hope to see more of this core in the future :)
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Re: New MSX core In The Works

Unread post by LamerDeluxe »

Great core already! I tried a number of games and most run well. Audio seems a bit distorted and off-key sometimes, but I haven't checked against the other core yet. I like that it has shadow mask support already.
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Re: New MSX core In The Works

Unread post by tontonkaloun »

Thank you !!!!!!!!!!
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Re: New MSX core In The Works

Unread post by molekula »

vampier wrote: Thu Jan 06, 2022 3:42 pm Does the core support audio in (loading from tape?)
Yes,

today's version allows emulation of the audio IN and cassette player. However, I have not tried the audio IN. I don't have it available on my HW.
The cassette player emulation assumes a CAS file for MSX from the Mame project. I have tested it cursorily on one game composed of several files (Zoot (1986)(Bug-Byte Software)[RUN'CAS-'].cas).
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Re: New MSX core In The Works

Unread post by breiztiger »

thanks for your work !!!
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Re: New MSX core In The Works

Unread post by funkychimp »

Thank you for this core. I’ve been waiting for ages for a core that can directly load images. Made my day this :)
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Re: New MSX core In The Works

Unread post by NinjaWarrior »

molekula wrote: Thu Jan 06, 2022 7:56 pm
vampier wrote: Thu Jan 06, 2022 3:42 pm Does the core support audio in (loading from tape?)
Yes,

today's version allows emulation of the audio IN and cassette player. However, I have not tried the audio IN. I don't have it available on my HW.
The cassette player emulation assumes a CAS file for MSX from the Mame project. I have tested it cursorily on one game composed of several files (Zoot (1986)(Bug-Byte Software)[RUN'CAS-'].cas).
That's just wonderful! Being able to load CAS files from OSD is great! Thank you!
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Re: New MSX core In The Works

Unread post by NML32 »

I loaded Arkanoid via the ADC Tape-In port from a YouTube video. :) It worked!!
The YT video I used to load the game via Audio In on the MiSTer.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PGVBJVFMZss
the load command: run"cas:"
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Re: New MSX core In The Works

Unread post by pgimeno »

Wicked!

The audio sounds saturated, like the sum of the channels overflows the 16 bits of the DAC, because when the volume is low it seems to work fine. Reducing the volume of individual channels might help.
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Re: New MSX core In The Works

Unread post by wark91 »

Thank you @molekula for the fix on sound (https://github.com/tdlabac/MSX1_MiSTer/ ... 81b2b31419)
It is a great improvement !
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Re: New MSX core In The Works

Unread post by marcelosofth »

Hello friend, I just tested it, here in Brazil it is the second home of MSX outside Japan, it has a legion of very loyal fans, I really liked your work, even Shadow Mask was added amazing, we await here new advances! 👏🕹️
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