PWM on 18-bit DAC to get 24-bit Color

[Neocaron]

This not being in main still blows my mind XD

[dickhardpill]

Would you be able to do a final update on the Saturn core when the core gets buttoned up? Feels like were in the homestretch of development and it would be amazing to have PWM on the final or near final release so it could be the definitive way of playing Saturn games.
Thanks so much again!

I'll make new builds probably about once a month if there are updates. Cores are updated to latest source today.

You are awesome! Thank you it looks pretty darn amazing!

[naylord]

One question, the PWM feature does work with forced_scandoubler right? That's not like a VGA scaler since it just line doubles without needing to do any extra scaling of any kind. To my eye it looks like banding is improved on the Saturn core with scandoubler on with pwm core vs vanilla but I thought I'd double check it's not a placebo if scandoubler disables it like VGA_Scaler does.

[Ruleset]

One question, the PWM feature does work with forced_scandoubler right? That's not like a VGA scaler since it just line doubles without needing to do any extra scaling of any kind. To my eye it looks like banding is improved on the Saturn core with scandoubler on with pwm core vs vanilla but I thought I'd double check it's not a placebo if scandoubler disables it like VGA_Scaler does.

Yes, the scandoubler doesn't use the scaler as far a I know, so PWM should work. What games are you testing on Saturn that show a difference? I only could find the FMV in the japanese version of Castlevania that showed less banding, but I didn't try too many games.

[metalfacemark]

Thanks, just had a play with this - looks great!

[naylord]

One question, the PWM feature does work with forced_scandoubler right? That's not like a VGA scaler since it just line doubles without needing to do any extra scaling of any kind. To my eye it looks like banding is improved on the Saturn core with scandoubler on with pwm core vs vanilla but I thought I'd double check it's not a placebo if scandoubler disables it like VGA_Scaler does.

Yes, the scandoubler doesn't use the scaler as far a I know, so PWM should work. What games are you testing on Saturn that show a difference? I only could find the FMV in the japanese version of Castlevania that showed less banding, but I didn't try too many games.

I was playing Panzer Dragoon Zwei and it looked like banding was reduced in the FMV. I'll try booting up castlevania as the grey fog in the opening cutscene is a very obvious place to see tons of banding.

[Dr Johnny Bananas]

This is very interesting, Saturn is my favorite core. I'm going to try these tonight.

Thank you!

[stanenc]

Made an account to say that version 20240408 solved my entire issue I was having on a vga lcd display. Let me know if there is anything I can do to get this into the main branches because this is unbelievable. No way in heck the solution should be to purchase an entirely new board when solutions like this exist.

[Sarge]

Very impressed with this. Hopefully Sorgelig will relent some day and add to main.

[Neocaron]

Hello there! If possible could we get this for the N64 turbo core as wel as the PSX turbo core? I have quartus installed and a pretty fast CPU so if it's a modification not too complex, I'd love to do it myself and share it here

[Ruleset]

Hello there! If possible could we get this for the N64 turbo core as wel as the PSX turbo core? I have quartus installed and a pretty fast CPU so if it's a modification not too complex, I'd love to do it myself and share it here

Sure you can try if you want. You will have to get the source from FPGAZumSpass and ask what the minimum acceptable timing slacks are.

Just add everything that is in this commit: https://github.com/Jokippo/N64_MiSTer_P ... baca5ce720

FPGAZumSpass did mention it took him 10 hours on a 13900k with 8 builds in parallel to get a good N64 Turbo build, and that was without PWM added, so I don't know if it is even possible. But I can add the build to the OP if you succeed.

[KennyL]

Thank you so much for keeping these cores updated and fixing n64 core!

[KennyL]

Thank you again for the update!

PSX_PWM_20240831.rbf update contains big MDEC update by paulb-nl et al. that fixes many 2d background and fmv issues.

https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/PSX_MiSTer/issues/260

Looking at this comparison provided by Robert, MDEC accuracy is getting super close!

grafik.png (2.31 MiB) Viewed 4376 times

[naylord]

Just playing some Gurentai on the pwm saturn core. It's incredible how great it looks on my 31khz vga monitor! Only issue is with the scandoubler the start menu is always in 480i (which makes sense, lots of text, static movement so no interlacing artifacts really) but because of that the scandoubler doesn't seem to work so I have to do those menus blind but I'm just getting such a pristine banding free image for gameplay it just can't be beat.

[amano]

Can this patch be included in the N64 Turbo Core?

[Ruleset]

Can this patch be included in the N64 Turbo Core?

I will probably try to make a turbo PWM build once FPGAZumSpass updates the turbo core, but I can't guarantee that a build is possible.

[Xtro]

It would be nice adding support to Minimig core, at least AGA Amigas would benefit from a PWM build

[Mysteryberto]

Thanks so much for these cores. I was playing Mario 64 the other day and noticed the banding in the main hall. After loading the PWM core it was all gone!

[Marlus]

Hello friends, I started using the PS1's CORE PWM today and unfortunately the problem with the color remains. Am I doing something wrong?

Game: Dino Crisis 2

[Ruleset]

Hello friends, I started using the PS1's CORE PWM today and unfortunately the problem with the color remains. Am I doing something wrong?

Game: Dino Crisis 2

Do you mean that the picture has too much red in the PWM build? Is this also the case in the regular build?

[Marlus]

Between CORE PSX_PWM and Original Hardware there appears to be a color difference. in Dino Crisis 2 you can clearly notice the difference, I also noticed it in RE3. Green sometimes appears grayish or non-existent. When compared to HDMI, the difference is also very noticeable.

[Ruleset]

Between CORE PSX_PWM and Original Hardware there appears to be a color difference. in Dino Crisis 2 you can clearly notice the difference, I also noticed it in RE3. Green sometimes appears grayish or non-existent. When compared to HDMI, the difference is also very noticeable.

Is this difference also on the regular non-PWM core on component? I am trying to see if the PWM messes with the colors or if the problem is just inherent to the analog component output of the PSX core. Also I assume the ps1 component is from a ps2?

[Marlus]

1 - Is this difference also on the regular non-PWM core on component? Yes

2 - Also I assume the ps1 component is from a ps2? No, PS1 original Hardware

[Ruleset]

1 - Is this difference also on the regular non-PWM core on component? Yes

2 - Also I assume the ps1 component is from a ps2? No, PS1 original Hardware

If the colors on the regular PSX Core are wrong then it is possible that the RGB to component calculations may need to be revisited by someone with a ps2 and a 24-bit i/o board.

Testing it on a RGB CRT, the colors look more like the HDMI output so I think the problem is probably something to do with the component color conversion.

I wasn't aware there are ps1's with component output, are you converting the signal in some way?

[Marlus]

I wasn't aware there are ps1's with component output, are you converting the signal in some way? Yes

"If the colors on the regular PSX Core are wrong" Unfortunately they are

[amano]

Thanks to ruleset for updating the Saturn core again. That's an important one with the sound support nearing perfection and mouse support being the new kid on the block.