MiSTer FPGA Forum

Posted: **Wed May 27, 2020 8:03 am**

So, the forum has been open a few days now, and no posts about the venerable Spectrum!
C'mon guys, let' get some discussion going.
Here, I'll start - with the Spectrum Next being open source, does anybody want to see Spectrum Next specific functionality available in MiSTer?
My thoughts are 'not necessarily so' - I have all the nostalgia I'm after with base ZX Spectrum functionality

Posted: **Wed May 27, 2020 8:42 am**

The current Spectrum core is pretty much perfect for me.

It can run ULA+ games and the Spectrum 2+ upgraded audio, and I think it even supports reading things from tape if you have the ADC input.
What else would it need?

Posted: **Wed May 27, 2020 8:54 am**

The core of the Spectrum is not bad, but it has a great fault, which is to be able to run ESXDOS that will open a wide range of possibilities to our beloved 8-bit system. Only this new feature would bring it very close to ZX-UNO (if not exceed it).

Posted: **Wed May 27, 2020 9:08 am**

ESXDOS gives nothing new.
And since ESXDOS requires direct access to SD card, it will require to use VHD image which you have to manage somehow to add/replace the files. This is much worse than simply put tap/tzx/dsk to spectrum folder.
All Spectrum games are available in one of supported form. Most games are converted to disk version.

Posted: **Wed May 27, 2020 10:01 am**

I think you are wrong, ESXDOS opens many possibilities to Spectrum, because among other things, there are a multitude of disk images with this operating system as the basis for abundant software.
It would not be necessary to have direct access to any SD, the necessary driver could be developed just as it has been done with the hard disk images of other cores (MSX, AtariST, ...). Anyway ESXDOS support FAT32 as file system.
http://www.esxdos.org/index.html

Posted: **Wed May 27, 2020 3:53 pm**

I would love to see the Spectrum Next core on MiSTer, not for the nostalgia factor but to support a fun new platform. I remember seeing on the old forum that someone was working on porting it, so hopefully that will work out.

Posted: **Wed May 27, 2020 3:57 pm**

I have the source ported to MiSTer but the SDRAM is not working. Maybe someone could help.

Posted: **Wed May 27, 2020 4:03 pm**

I don't know anything the details of this stuff myself but is this link helpful?

https://github.com/nullobject/sdram-fpga?files=1

I believe this was written by the guy who made the Rygar core so he may be on here.

Posted: **Wed May 27, 2020 4:48 pm**

Miguel T80c wrote: ↑Wed May 27, 2020 10:01 am I think you are wrong, ESXDOS opens many possibilities to Spectrum, because among other things, there are a multitude of disk images with this operating system as the basis for abundant software.
It would not be necessary to have direct access to any SD, the necessary driver could be developed just as it has been done with the hard disk images of other cores (MSX, AtariST, ...). Anyway ESXDOS support FAT32 as file system.
http://www.esxdos.org/index.html

I know what ESXDOS and DivMMC are. One of earlier version of my ZX core supported it. It was looking like 5th leg for a dog. Quite useless option sandboxed in VHD container. And it doesn't allow to use 128K Basic leaving Spectrum in permanent (but unlocked) 48K mode.

Posted: **Wed May 27, 2020 6:49 pm**

mister also supports LFN

Posted: **Wed May 27, 2020 9:30 pm**

yeah, ESXDOS never hit the release with LFN support. There was some beta version. Pretty much abandoned.

Posted: **Thu May 28, 2020 7:51 am**

Having Next core would be really great, but I think I've read somewhere (ZX-Uno related) it's supposed to be exclusive to the hardware?

Posted: **Thu May 28, 2020 7:53 am**

Not really, you have to have the license, but we have it.

Posted: **Thu May 28, 2020 10:02 am**

That's fabulous, hope you can get it up and running at some point

Posted: **Thu May 28, 2020 3:44 pm**

The current ZX Spectrum core is great.
Runs pretty much flawlessly, and rather than seeing ESXDOS on it, I'd rather see a Spectrum Next core become a reality.

Fingers crossed this will become a reality soon.

Posted: **Thu May 28, 2020 4:07 pm**

I will be a very happy chappy the day I can play Melkhior's Mansion on my MiSTer

Posted: **Thu May 28, 2020 4:32 pm**

NightShadowPT wrote: ↑Thu May 28, 2020 3:44 pm The current ZX Spectrum core is great.
Runs pretty much flawlessly, and rather than seeing ESXDOS on it, I'd rather see a Spectrum Next core become a reality.

Fingers crossed this will become a reality soon.

WoW, that if that would be a good substitute. Is there news about this development?

Posted: **Fri May 29, 2020 7:05 am**

akeley wrote: ↑Thu May 28, 2020 7:51 am Having Next core would be really great, but I think I've read somewhere (ZX-Uno related) it's supposed to be exclusive to the hardware?

The code is open source and the team is not against ports to other boards. What is not allowed, however, is branding a port as "Spectrum Next" as the brand is being used under license from Sky.

Posted: **Fri May 29, 2020 3:14 pm**

antonie wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 7:05 am The code is open source and the team is not against ports to other boards. What is not allowed, however, is branding a port as "Spectrum Next" as the brand is being used under license from Sky.

SpecNXT would do it

Posted: **Fri May 29, 2020 5:33 pm**

NightShadowPT wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 3:14 pm
antonie wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 7:05 am The code is open source and the team is not against ports to other boards. What is not allowed, however, is branding a port as "Spectrum Next" as the brand is being used under license from Sky.
SpecNXT would do it

True...however, changing the Machine ID to SpecNXT potentially creates software compatibility issues. There is a specnext.com forum entry on this issue somewhere. Whoever wishes to port this core must deal with two major stumbling blocks (1) the Machine ID issue, and (2) the fact that the Spectrum Next uses SRAM. Furthermore, as the system (and other) software "lives" on a SD Card, a vhd image solution would also have to be created.

I'd love to try out the Spectrum Next on MiSTer. I'm super curious to compare this core to the actual machine I own.

Posted: **Fri May 29, 2020 9:12 pm**

antonie wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 5:33 pm True...however, changing the Machine ID to SpecNXT potentially creates software compatibility issues.

If they don't actually have any hardware to sell, you'd think they'd be actively encouraging clones and ports in the hope that more people will develop software for it, and keep the community alive? (If there's legal issues around the Spectrum name/branding, there should have been a way to work around that without causing software incompatibilities)

If you missed the Kickstarter over 3 years ago, the only way to actually get one is to pay around £1000 on eBay... and there's obstacles in the way of clones/ports?? - that's hardly going to create a thriving platform, is it...

Posted: **Sat May 30, 2020 10:26 am**

There are some misconceptions above. The Next team are very keen to support clones and ports, the only restriction I believe is that you are not allowed to use the Sinclair logo because they had to license it from Sky. Each implementation gets assigned a machine ID, and this can be used to display the appropriate platform logo when NextZXOS boots up. I know currently there are at least ports to UnAmiga and ZXDOS, and the latter even has its own specially customized version of the Spectrum Next manual written by the Next team.

To quote a member of the Next team on their Facebook group: "And not only do we encourage other authors to port the next core to their boards, and allocate them board IDs and host their logo, but we then try to host any documentation required to help people how to set up those boards as a next, where applicable."

Posted: **Sat May 30, 2020 11:48 am**

Spectrum Next uses SRAM and MiSTer DDR and SDRAM,
I am afraid that if a driver is not developed (very difficult) it is not going to be possible that we will see a clone in our FPGA.

Posted: **Sun May 31, 2020 12:56 pm**

Miguel T80c wrote: ↑Sat May 30, 2020 11:48 am Spectrum Next uses SRAM and MiSTer DDR and SDRAM,
I am afraid that if a driver is not developed (very difficult) it is not going to be possible that we will see a clone in our FPGA.

For my education, can you specify what is the challenge exactly?

I understand timings can differ, but you're making it sound much harder, so I'm keen to learn more about the why.

Thanks

Posted: **Sun May 31, 2020 4:18 pm**

It sounds like this because it really is not an easy task, it is not a simple port, it is necessary to solve the SRAM problem before. It is what I have heard from a couple of developers, but who knows ... maybe someone will come and solve this problem quickly.

Posted: **Wed Jun 03, 2020 6:45 am**

Miguel T80c wrote: ↑Sun May 31, 2020 4:18 pm It sounds like this because it really is not an easy task, it is not a simple port, it is necessary to solve the SRAM problem before. It is what I have heard from a couple of developers, but who knows ... maybe someone will come and solve this problem quickly.

The core is also under continuous development and improvement. So, unlike a traditional "retro" core where the effort is largely focussed on making it as accurate as possible, with the Next, the port will have to contend with new features, or bug fixes, being made in each new official release.
Not impossible, for sure, but it does create "management overhead" to ensure the MiSTer core remains synchronised with the main core.

Posted: **Wed Jun 03, 2020 1:35 pm**

Newsdee wrote: ↑Wed May 27, 2020 8:42 am The current Spectrum core is pretty much perfect for me.

It can run ULA+ games and the Spectrum 2+ upgraded audio, and I think it even supports reading things from tape if you have the ADC input.
What else would it need?

Yes, supports loading from tapes with ACC board input. Loading works great, like real spectrum feel.

Posted: **Fri Jun 05, 2020 7:16 am**

Direct port with just external tweaks is impossible.
But i'm sure with some deep modification of ram handling inside the core the port is possible.
MiST and its clones are in the same boat and will require the same in-dept changes to port the Next, so i suggest to widen your search for someone to port. If someone will port it to MiST, then it will be easy to port to MiSTer from there. Ask Gyurco (Slingshot) if he is willing to port to MiST

I know he is a fan of ZX Spectrum.

As i've told earlier, i'm not really interesting in Next so i don't want to spend my time for core which is basically the same as existing ZX Spectum core. So i'm not willing to do in-dept modifications to port.
The biggest issue (if it will be ported) with Next will be requirement of VHD image. So you will have to put files inside that image to access them in Next core. It's very inconvenient. My ZX Spectrum core works with files on SD card, so it's a way more convenient to manage.

Posted: **Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:23 pm**

kiFla wrote: ↑Wed Jun 03, 2020 1:35 pmYes, supports loading from tapes with ACC board input. Loading works great, like real spectrum feel.

You could just buy a Next or a repro Speccy.

Posted: **Fri Jun 05, 2020 6:51 pm**

Sorgelig wrote: ↑Fri Jun 05, 2020 7:16 am Direct port with just external tweaks is impossible.
But i'm sure with some deep modification of ram handling inside the core the port is possible.
MiST and its clones are in the same boat and will require the same in-dept changes to port the Next, so i suggest to widen your search for someone to port. If someone will port it to MiST, then it will be easy to port to MiSTer from there. Ask Gyurco (Slingshot) if he is willing to port to MiST
I know he is a fan of ZX Spectrum.

As i've told earlier, i'm not really interesting in Next so i don't want to spend my time for core which is basically the same as existing ZX Spectum core. So i'm not willing to do in-dept modifications to port.
The biggest issue (if it will be ported) with Next will be requirement of VHD image. So you will have to put files inside that image to access them in Next core. It's very inconvenient. My ZX Spectrum core works with files on SD card, so it's a way more convenient to manage.

I am working in the Mister port of ZX Next. I have the core Running in Altera Cyclone V Board with 512 Kb of SRAM without problems.
The problem here is using the SDRAM instead SRAM. The VRAM part of the core is too big (96 Kb) compared with Spectrum core (16Kb) and is not in a static address. This is a serious problem to port to Mist due we do not have enough BRAM in Mist.
Regards

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