Page 1 of 1
Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Thu May 28, 2020 6:12 pm
by Awestyn
Anyone working on cores for vector monitor game output?
Here's Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA running in a cabinet with a vector monitor.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NVzlWMWNjeQ
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Thu May 28, 2020 6:45 pm
by alanswx
There was a college project to make Tempest but I haven't been able to get it running. If you find source post it / send me a private message.
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Thu May 28, 2020 7:08 pm
by LeftEmpty
Wow I hadn't even given a thought about this being possible.
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Thu May 28, 2020 8:34 pm
by ARCADEAGES
There is already a Vectrex core on MiSTer that I believe can output to real vector monitors.
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Thu May 28, 2020 10:26 pm
by ARCADEAGES
Lunar Lander MiSTer core is also able to do true vector output
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Fri May 29, 2020 5:59 am
by Awestyn
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Fri May 29, 2020 6:25 am
by LeftEmpty
Out of curiosity, is it as simple as hooking a vga monitor, or does this require some heavy fiddling into the magical art know as electronics?
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Fri May 29, 2020 6:44 am
by LamerDeluxe
ARCADEAGES wrote: ↑Thu May 28, 2020 8:34 pm
There is already a Vectrex core on MiSTer that I believe can output to real vector monitors.
Is this a recent addition? I asked for this before. How would you hook it up to a scope? I have a real Vectrex though, so I'd love to see the vector arcade games support output to scopes and vector monitors.
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Fri May 29, 2020 1:09 pm
by ash2fpga
LeftEmpty wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 6:25 am
Out of curiosity, is it as simple as hooking a vga monitor, or does this require some heavy fiddling into the magical art know as electronics?
For vector output? Heavy fiddling indeed. Ex:
https://hackaday.io/project/2871-build- ... or-monitor
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Fri May 29, 2020 7:13 pm
by Vic20-Ian
Really good work on Tempest, great game. Almost playable on the Jaguar emulator but still crashes.
I look forward to seeing this on MiSTer along with all the great Vector games like Star Castle.
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Tue Jun 02, 2020 5:32 pm
by retrorepair
I've got a crappy 20" Alba CRT waiting for a project like this..
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Tue Jul 28, 2020 6:25 pm
by djb_rh
I’m new here, but assuming someone got vector game cores working, would they REQUIRE a vector monitor or could they also work on an LCD? Yes, I know about all the reasons why an LCD would be inferior, but I’d REALLY rather have an FPGA solution than a MAME one in my repro MH cabinet, but I am *not* going to be trying to keep a vector CRT working.
And like my EDOT post, I’d contribute money to anyone who made significant contributions to making something like that happen.
—Donnie
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Tue Jul 28, 2020 7:17 pm
by alanswx
The current vector cores work with hdmi output.
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Tue Jul 28, 2020 9:33 pm
by SuperBabyHix
With the recent speed improvements made to the ao486 core the MS-DOS version of Tempest 2000 runs really well. The game doesn't seem to support mouse control though, which seems unfortunate.
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 3:33 pm
by lnielsen
Instead of converting a raster monitor to a vector monitor, I have been thinking about an LED laser display. There have been numerous projects like this with galvanometers. My thought is similar to an old rear projection screen where it would project the image on the cabinet screen from underneath. I have not done a lot of research yet but this seems easier than projecting onto the wall.
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2020 1:55 am
by dokworm
Any chance it could interface to the USB-DVG board? Its a board that will output to Atari XY monitors or Sega G08 XY monitors via MAME.
In theory if you could output via USB from the MISTer or Vectrex version, then we could develop all the old vector games and then run them on real vector monitors. I mean, you can do that with MAME and the USB-DVG board now, but I'd much rather have an FPGA based system like the MISTer running things.
There isn't much difference in the difficulty between projecting the laser onto the wall vs onto a rear-projection screen. Would be a cool project, but speed and lag would be tricky to overcome.
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Sat Aug 15, 2020 2:52 pm
by shertz
Yes. The usb-dvg looks awesome! Hope it can work with the MiSTer....
https://youtu.be/sIL8DNRB-8g
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2022 8:42 am
by venice
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Thu Oct 06, 2022 2:30 pm
by bgaul
lnielsen wrote: ↑Wed Jul 29, 2020 3:33 pm
Instead of converting a raster monitor to a vector monitor, I have been thinking about an LED laser display. There have been numerous projects like this with galvanometers. My thought is similar to an old rear projection screen where it would project the image on the cabinet screen from underneath. I have not done a lot of research yet but this seems easier than projecting onto the wall.
Alas, even Asteroids is too much for one set of galvos.
My best hope is Optical Phase Arrays which are being developed for automotive lidar.
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2023 5:41 pm
by pashdown
The VSTCM may be a way for MiSTer to support vector displays. The USB-DVG protocol talks over USB to control the VSTCM and the display.
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2023 7:03 pm
by LamerDeluxe
pashdown wrote: ↑Thu Jan 12, 2023 5:41 pm
The VSTCM may be a way for MiSTer to support vector displays. The USB-DVG protocol talks over USB to control the VSTCM and the display.
Really interesting, would be great if this could work with the MiSTer. Also interesting how apparently straightforward it is to convert a CRT color TV to a color vector display.
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2023 10:59 am
by MikkyTee
Ever tried vector games on coinops etc? The way (mame?) it handles these games is really impressive. There are many tweaks to adjust the visual quality, even adding the flickering of a vector display.
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2023 5:40 pm
by LamerDeluxe
The way the display of my Vectrex looks can't be replicated on a TFT display. Maybe emulation using HDR could get close on an OLED display, but even then you'd still have pixels.
Sadly never seen a color vector arcade game IRL. Haven't been able to find one here in the Netherlands.
The MiSTer vector cores draw their vectors using the FPGA. There is a lot of room for improvements with how that looks, but it is probably really hard to develop on the FPGA.
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2023 6:16 pm
by FPGA64
LamerDeluxe wrote: ↑Fri Jan 13, 2023 5:40 pm
The way the display of my Vectrex looks can't be replicated on a TFT display. Maybe emulation using HDR could get close on an OLED display, but even then you'd still have pixels.
Sadly never seen a color vector arcade game IRL. Haven't been able to find one here in the Netherlands.
The MiSTer vector cores draw their vectors using the FPGA. There is a lot of room for improvements with how that looks, but it is probably really hard to develop on the FPGA.
You have never seen the Original Star Wars Vector ?
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2023 7:24 pm
by thorr
Asteroids is vector and already on the MiSTer. I hope we can get Star Wars one of these days, especially considering the arcade cabinet I am making is designed in the spirit of a Star Wars arcade cabinet with the Star Wars artwork on it.
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2023 8:25 pm
by LamerDeluxe
FPGA64 wrote: ↑Fri Jan 13, 2023 6:16 pm
LamerDeluxe wrote: ↑Fri Jan 13, 2023 5:40 pm
The way the display of my Vectrex looks can't be replicated on a TFT display. Maybe emulation using HDR could get close on an OLED display, but even then you'd still have pixels.
Sadly never seen a color vector arcade game IRL. Haven't been able to find one here in the Netherlands.
The MiSTer vector cores draw their vectors using the FPGA. There is a lot of room for improvements with how that looks, but it is probably really hard to develop on the FPGA.
You have never seen the Original Star Wars Vector ?
Sadly I haven't, not even in the eighties. Played the Amiga version a lot. Saw a vector arcade machine for the first time last year, Asteroids. Still haven't seen a color one.
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2023 8:27 pm
by FPGA64
We had one at University so I played it a ton. Asteroids I played in a dark room at the back of a Video shop.
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2023 10:30 am
by LamerDeluxe
FPGA64 wrote: ↑Fri Jan 13, 2023 8:27 pm
We had one at University so I played it a ton. Asteroids I played in a dark room at the back of a Video shop.
Awesome, that must have been a magical experience at the time.
Re: Tempest and Major Havoc FPGA
Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2023 2:05 pm
by Lightwave
Asteroids is my first memory of playing a non-pinball arcade game, some time around the summer of 1980.
My friend’s father took us to a dingy bar, and while he drank gave us money for ice cream and quarters for Asteroids. I remember being totally entranced by that vector display; it did feel magical!
Vector games were great, played a lot of Battlezone and Star Wars back then too. The funny thing is I didn’t really like Tempest at the time, but now it’s probably my favorite vector game (although I’ll always love Star Wars for the theme; “The Force will be with you, always” voice sample still gives me goosebumps)