Networking Under MS-DOS

abbub
Posts: 36
Joined: Mon May 25, 2020 3:52 pm
Location: Fort Collins, CO
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 7 times
Contact:

Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by abbub »

Here's how to get the mTCP TCP/IP applications up and running under DOS with the ao486 core:

1. Download the DOS PPPD driver:
DOSPPP06.ZIP
(325.77 KiB) Downloaded 555 times
2. Grab the latest version of Michael Brutman's mTCP TCP/IP applications for MS-DOS, from the 'Downloads' section on this page:

http://www.brutman.com/mTCP/

3. Transfer those zip files over to your ao486's virtual hard drive and unzip them into the directory of your choice (I used C:\NETWORK).

4. In the OSD for the ao486 core, set the UART mode to (PPP) and reset the core if needed.

5. In DOS on the core, you need to edit a mtcp config file. There's a sample config in the SAMPLES directory called 'sample.cfg' that you can use as a base, or you can use my example below (I named my mtcp.cfg, and saved it in C:\NETWORK). If you use the sample.cfg file, you need to add the top MTCPSLIP line.:

Code: Select all

SET MTCPSLIP=true
mtu 1500
packetint 0x60
hostname ao486_fpga

IPADDR 10.0.1.254 <- Change this to reflect your network.
NETMASK 255.255.255.0
GATEWAY 10.0.1.1 <- Change this to reflect your network.
NAMESERVER 8.8.8.8 <- You can change this to reflect your network if you want to.
LEASE_TIME 86400
IRCJR_USER FPGA_User
IRCJR_NICK fpga_user
IRCJR_NAME FPGA_User
6. The DOS PPPD driver archive includes the ppp packet driver, which you need to load:

Code: Select all

epppd com1 115200 local
7. Before any of the mTCP commands can be run, you need to tell them where to find the mtcp config file you created in step 6:

Code: Select all

set mtcpcfg=c:\network\mtcp.cfg
(Obviously, the path and name needs to be changed to reflect where you created the mtcp config file.)

8. Ping a server and you should see it work:

Code: Select all

ping google.com
9. Enjoy telnet, ftp, irc, and other internet applications while you use MS-DOS. Be sure and make sure you have ANSI.SYS loaded in config.sys if you want to use the telnet client to hit telnet bbses. :)

Note:
I've had this working on the stable ao486 core, and also the most recent versions of the 'experimental cache' cores that have been posted.
User avatar
tontonkaloun
Posts: 354
Joined: Sun May 24, 2020 7:38 pm
Has thanked: 152 times
Been thanked: 51 times

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by tontonkaloun »

Thank you for sharing
User avatar
Caldor
Top Contributor
Posts: 930
Joined: Sat Jul 25, 2020 11:20 am
Has thanked: 112 times
Been thanked: 111 times

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by Caldor »

This reminds me that there now exists a DOS Internet browser... :)
Guide:
http://www.kompx.com/en/arachne-install ... hernet.htm

Video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FVDkWU_Gzss
abbub
Posts: 36
Joined: Mon May 25, 2020 3:52 pm
Location: Fort Collins, CO
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 7 times
Contact:

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by abbub »

Not on ao486, but I've had arachene and lynx running under DOS, and also a DOS gopher client. Once you get the packet driver loaded and working, you can create a simple wattcp.cfg with your ip, gateway, and net mask, and use Waterloo TCP apps, too. The mTCP applications are a lot of bang for the buck.

I've also had success loading a 'Big DOS' window in desqview, and running an IRC window while fooling around with word perfect, turbo pascal, rogue ( ;) ) and other applications in their own windows.
User avatar
Caldor
Top Contributor
Posts: 930
Joined: Sat Jul 25, 2020 11:20 am
Has thanked: 112 times
Been thanked: 111 times

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by Caldor »

I am right now busy making VHDs full of disk images, so I can try out installing classic games, many where I created these images from my own disks.

But I am hoping someone might share their experience trying to use a browser and the FTP in DOS on AO486
abbub
Posts: 36
Joined: Mon May 25, 2020 3:52 pm
Location: Fort Collins, CO
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 7 times
Contact:

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by abbub »

Caldor wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 9:04 pm But I am hoping someone might share their experience trying to use a browser and the FTP in DOS on AO486
I use FTP all the time on it. It works very well. Honestly, I haven't bothered to install a browser because I've run them under DOS before, and frankly they're not very useful.
User avatar
Caldor
Top Contributor
Posts: 930
Joined: Sat Jul 25, 2020 11:20 am
Has thanked: 112 times
Been thanked: 111 times

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by Caldor »

abbub wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 9:12 pm
Caldor wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 9:04 pm But I am hoping someone might share their experience trying to use a browser and the FTP in DOS on AO486
I use FTP all the time on it. It works very well. Honestly, I haven't bothered to install a browser because I've run them under DOS before, and frankly they're not very useful.
Yeah, I am guessing its not that many websites that will work. I guess it can support HTML and PHP based sites, but anything with some type of Javascript will be a problem. Or a site that has video or big images or... yeah... but its fun that its possible.
Glaurung
Posts: 9
Joined: Sun Aug 02, 2020 3:02 pm

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by Glaurung »

Some knows A BBS easy/best to install?
abbub
Posts: 36
Joined: Mon May 25, 2020 3:52 pm
Location: Fort Collins, CO
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 7 times
Contact:

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by abbub »

Glaurung wrote: Fri Aug 07, 2020 8:58 pm Some knows A BBS easy/best to install?
You mean to host a BBS for telnet under DOS? I'm not sure. I think the first thing you'd need would be a fossil driver of some sort.
bbond007
Top Contributor
Posts: 518
Joined: Tue May 26, 2020 5:06 am
Has thanked: 85 times
Been thanked: 197 times

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by bbond007 »

Glaurung wrote: Fri Aug 07, 2020 8:58 pm Some knows A BBS easy/best to install?
Some discussion of running BBS software a while back here --> https://www.atari-forum.com/viewtopic.p ... 93#p383893
User avatar
jrronimo
Posts: 79
Joined: Sat Jul 04, 2020 6:03 pm
Has thanked: 31 times
Been thanked: 11 times

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by jrronimo »

I used to run a SearchLight BBS many years ago and found it pretty friendly, but that was in the days of dial-up (SearchLight 4.5b). I believe SearchLight 5.x had telnet support, but was also considered a little buggy. It's probably not the greatest choice, but it's the one that would be most nostalgic for me. :D

Plus it supports RipTerm, the vector-based graphical interface from back then. I know TrashCan BBS still supports it. :D
User avatar
jrronimo
Posts: 79
Joined: Sat Jul 04, 2020 6:03 pm
Has thanked: 31 times
Been thanked: 11 times

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by jrronimo »

abbub wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 8:30 pm Here's how to get the mTCP TCP/IP applications up and running under DOS with the ao486 core:
...snip for length...
This is a really great tutorial, but I'm running into a problem: I can't ping anything. After I run

Code: Select all

epppd com1 115200 local
, it says
Installed packet driver handler at vector 0x60.
But if I try to ping even 192.168.1.1, it times out.

I've followed this guide pretty closely. I do have the "set mtcpcfg" line in my autoexec rather than in the mtcp.cfg file though. It doesn't work either way. I'm at a loss... Anyone have any pointers or problems they ran into?

Edit to add: I'm using the Cache41 release. I can talk to my MiSTer from the local network just fine. CONFIG.SYS loads himem & emm386. I have Windows for Workgroups 3.11 installed, but without a network adapter.
abbub
Posts: 36
Joined: Mon May 25, 2020 3:52 pm
Location: Fort Collins, CO
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 7 times
Contact:

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by abbub »

Hrm. I went over the instructions again and it looks like everything is there, but let me double check against my mister and make sure I didn't miss anything. I had issues on the earlier cached versions, but since about 38 it's been working for me. I'm on 40, though, not 41.
User avatar
zomgugoff
Posts: 33
Joined: Sun May 24, 2020 8:54 pm

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by zomgugoff »

When I run epppd, it pauses for a long time, then it errors with 'PPP link is down, driver not installed.' I've tried cache40 and 41. Am I missing something?
abbub
Posts: 36
Joined: Mon May 25, 2020 3:52 pm
Location: Fort Collins, CO
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 7 times
Contact:

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by abbub »

Do you have the UART mode set to PPP? I also had it working with Uart Speed set to 30x, but it was unstable, so I also recommend setting it to Normal.
abbub
Posts: 36
Joined: Mon May 25, 2020 3:52 pm
Location: Fort Collins, CO
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 7 times
Contact:

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by abbub »

jrronimo wrote: Sun Aug 09, 2020 8:07 pm
abbub wrote: Thu Aug 06, 2020 8:30 pm Here's how to get the mTCP TCP/IP applications up and running under DOS with the ao486 core:
...snip for length...
This is a really great tutorial, but I'm running into a problem: I can't ping anything. After I run

Code: Select all

epppd com1 115200 local
, it says
Installed packet driver handler at vector 0x60.
But if I try to ping even 192.168.1.1, it times out.

I've followed this guide pretty closely. I do have the "set mtcpcfg" line in my autoexec rather than in the mtcp.cfg file though. It doesn't work either way. I'm at a loss... Anyone have any pointers or problems they ran into?

Edit to add: I'm using the Cache41 release. I can talk to my MiSTer from the local network just fine. CONFIG.SYS loads himem & emm386. I have Windows for Workgroups 3.11 installed, but without a network adapter.
Do you have the 'SET MTCPSLIP=true' line at the top of your mtcp config? and are you using the 'ping' command from the mtcp package?
User avatar
zomgugoff
Posts: 33
Joined: Sun May 24, 2020 8:54 pm

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by zomgugoff »

abbub wrote: Mon Aug 10, 2020 3:25 am Do you have the UART mode set to PPP? I also had it working with Uart Speed set to 30x, but it was unstable, so I also recommend setting it to Normal.
I set it to PPP, saved it, and loaded the core fresh. I have the UART set to normal. I did try 30x, but it does the same thing. I even checked the midilink.ini for PPP settings and I didn't see any.
User avatar
jrronimo
Posts: 79
Joined: Sat Jul 04, 2020 6:03 pm
Has thanked: 31 times
Been thanked: 11 times

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by jrronimo »

abbub wrote: Mon Aug 10, 2020 3:28 am Do you have the 'SET MTCPSLIP=true' line at the top of your mtcp config? and are you using the 'ping' command from the mtcp package?
I've tried setting that in the mtcp config and then I tried setting it in the Autoexec as well, but neither worked. Yes, I'm using the ping command from the mtcp package.

I'm going to try setting up a fresh VM with nothing but DOS to see if that clears it up. Maybe something about the way I set up Windows is interfering or something... I don't know.
User avatar
zomgugoff
Posts: 33
Joined: Sun May 24, 2020 8:54 pm

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by zomgugoff »

I figured out my issue with the 'PPP link is down' error. If you have 2 network connections on MiSTer, PPP won't connect.
User avatar
jrronimo
Posts: 79
Joined: Sat Jul 04, 2020 6:03 pm
Has thanked: 31 times
Been thanked: 11 times

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by jrronimo »

I'm still having issues. I set up a new VHD and clean installed DOS 6.22, but MTCP still can't ping anything.

My CONFIG.SYS:

Code: Select all

DEVICE=C:\DOS\SETVER.EXE
DEVICE=C:\DOS\HIMEM.SYS /TESTMEM:OFF
DOS=HIGH,UMB
FILES=30
LASTDRIVE=Z
My AUTOEXEC.BAT:

Code: Select all

@ECHO OFF
SET BLASTER=A220 I5 D1 T3
SET SOUND=C:\SB
PATH C:\DOS;C:\UTILS\MXDIR;C:\UTILS\ZIPPING;
SET TEMP=C:\DOS
PROMPT $p$g
My MTCP.CFG

Code: Select all

SET MTCPSLIP=true
MTU 1500
PACKETINT 0x60
HOSTNAME ao486

IPADDR 192.168.1.70
NETMASK 255.255.255.0
GATEWAY 192.168.1.1
NAMESERVER 8.8.8.8
LEASE_TIME 86400
Does anything jump out at anyone as wrong?

I have UART mode set to PPP. I've rebooted. epppd installs at 0x60. I just don't know what's going on. For what it's worth, my MiSTer is showing its IP as 192.168.1.211.

I don't know why it's not talking... :(

Edit:// Is there any sort of setup I need to do on the MiSTer side? Is there some firewall that would prevent packets going between MiSTer and ao486?

If I use PKTTOOL.EXE STATS 60 in the MCP directory, it shows that it sees the packet driver and it even shows that packets are sending and receiving. I don't understand why I can't ping though. :/
User avatar
YLFAndy
Posts: 31
Joined: Sat Sep 12, 2020 10:25 pm
Location: Seattle Area
Been thanked: 2 times
Contact:

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by YLFAndy »

I'm in the same boat. I can't get anything to ping out after epppd installs. I've verified no conflicting host names and I've tried matching the IP of the MiSTER and choosing an unused IP in the network, but outside of the DHCP pool. Mask and gateway are correct, but I just get timeouts.

(I should add that I've also changed my MAC from the default 'combination on my luggage' address so there should be no conflicts on the network)
User avatar
YLFAndy
Posts: 31
Joined: Sat Sep 12, 2020 10:25 pm
Location: Seattle Area
Been thanked: 2 times
Contact:

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by YLFAndy »

Well, I've found my issue. The ppp daemon defaults to <network>.254. I had a NAS on that IP so I was getting conflicts. I had to edit /media/fat/linux/ppp_options and change the last entry to local gateway(the IP of the MiSTer):desired client IP (in my case 192.168.135.1:192.168.1.198). After that, everything worked great!
User avatar
thera34
Posts: 103
Joined: Fri Sep 11, 2020 7:51 am
Has thanked: 76 times
Been thanked: 56 times

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by thera34 »

Bump for a very useful guide and also a question:
Has anyone succeeded in transferring files via zmodem/xmodem from a BBS while using tcp/ip or the other method ? If yes, which terminal did you used and any particular settings ?

I have tried mTCP's telnet, Terminator 5.0 and Telix 3.51, none of them succeeded in transferring a file, just outputed some chars and i was forced to drop connection.

As a side note, on Amiga core, AmTelnet worked fine.
lroby74
Posts: 111
Joined: Tue May 26, 2020 2:59 pm
Has thanked: 125 times
Been thanked: 15 times

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by lroby74 »

Command and Conquer and / or other DOS games that may permit LAN gaming, may be playable on 2+ Misters FPGA on this way IMHO
bbond007
Top Contributor
Posts: 518
Joined: Tue May 26, 2020 5:06 am
Has thanked: 85 times
Been thanked: 197 times

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by bbond007 »

thera34 wrote: Tue Dec 15, 2020 9:39 am Bump for a very useful guide and also a question:
Has anyone succeeded in transferring files via zmodem/xmodem from a BBS while using tcp/ip or the other method ? If yes, which terminal did you used and any particular settings ?
Yes with Zmodem, but not with a TCP/IP stack. I use the modem emulation in MidiLink so I can use the same terminal programs I used back in the BBS era.

I use Qmodem or Procomm+ with the OSD setting UART:MIDI/Remote/TCP

The supported "AT" commands ate listed here:
https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/MidiLink_MiSTer

Example:
ATDTHOSTNAME:PORT
User avatar
thera34
Posts: 103
Joined: Fri Sep 11, 2020 7:51 am
Has thanked: 76 times
Been thanked: 56 times

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by thera34 »

@bbond007: You're right, by the "other method" I was referring to MidiLink. Thanks for the tip, will try Qmodem and Procomm to see how they behave.
Next thing will be to test out Syncterm or netrunner, not sure if they will work on Win95, but this is also beyond this topic.

On this topic: anyone tried SSH under MSDOS ?
Found out about SSHDOS (http://sshdos.sourceforge.net/) , gonna try it later and wondered if anyone has already tested it

Cheers and Happy Holidays all !
bbond007
Top Contributor
Posts: 518
Joined: Tue May 26, 2020 5:06 am
Has thanked: 85 times
Been thanked: 197 times

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by bbond007 »

Actually, Qmodem Pro 1.0 & Procom Plus 2.01 are the specific versions I use.

I also remember using a Windows version of Qmodem..
ExCyber
Posts: 217
Joined: Sun May 24, 2020 3:33 pm
Has thanked: 11 times
Been thanked: 66 times

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by ExCyber »

Anyone have any thoughts on network drive implementations? I played around with Microsoft's "Network Client 3.0" about a million years ago in hopes that it would be able to run games from a suitably neutered Samba share, but found that it took too much conventional memory to run most software. If memory serves, even EDIT couldn't run after loading the network stuff. I very much doubt that I figured out every piece that could either be disabled or shoved into high/UMB/XMS, but I've seen a few scattered mentions that a major chunk of conventional RAM usage is inevitable with that particular stack, so I assume it's a dead end unless someone has experience to the contrary.

Considering that MSCDEX allegedly uses the same underlying driver API as network drives, I have a hard time believing that this is an unsolved problem. I feel like some company should have released a sleek iSCSI or ATA over Ethernet driver (perhaps for arcane corporate market reasons, much like how it's surprisingly easy to find DOS drivers for modern Ethernet chipsets because some versions of Norton/Symantec Ghost can use them), but I haven't seen one.

I'm not even entirely averse to the notion of writing something like this myself (presumably working with mTCP, because I suspect that the idea of having written my own TCP stack is more appealing than the reality of actually doing it). That being said, it would definitely be a learning experience since while I was there for the heyday of DOS and real mode, I didn't really get into programming before protected mode operating systems were the norm.
mbalmer
Posts: 19
Joined: Wed May 27, 2020 3:08 pm
Has thanked: 3 times

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by mbalmer »

[deleted - I got it working]
User avatar
thera34
Posts: 103
Joined: Fri Sep 11, 2020 7:51 am
Has thanked: 76 times
Been thanked: 56 times

Re: Networking Under MS-DOS

Unread post by thera34 »

Bumping this thread as it has valuable info and it's the base on MS-DOS TCP/IP networking how-to

First things first, the same mTCP configuration will also work on the PC XT core.
I would also like to add several applications I have tested which make use of mTCP stack (other than mTCP's telnet/irc clients):

  1. ChatGPT DOS client - works perfect on both ao486 and PC XT, it also requires an external proxy (for convenience I used a RaspberryPI) to process SSL
    Where to get it and instructions (also for setting up a proxy): https://github.com/yeokm1/doschgpt
    Discord discussion/pics/other links: https://discord.com/channels/6479093974 ... 0785183864
    Note - working on getting that HTTP-to-HTTPS proxy to work on DE10-Nano's ARM

  2. MicroWeb DOS browser - works blazing fast on both ao486 and PC XT cores.
    It is text and HTTP only, but it can support external HTTP-to-HTTPS proxy. Also supports mouse and for PC XT you should launch it with the "-c" parameter
    Where to get it and instructions (also for the external proxy): https://github.com/jhhoward/MicroWeb
    Discord discussion/pics/other related links: https://discord.com/channels/6479093974 ... 8197096620
    As well as for ChatGPT, working on moving the proxy to ARM side

  3. Arachne graphical DOS web browser - works on ao486. Don't expect it to be fast or support modern pages, but on normal older HTTP sites it works like a charm
    Still fiddling with it and hopefully some SSL functionality can be added at some point (maybe some proxy as above or some Arachne plugins)
    Where to get it: http://www.glennmcc.org/arachne/
    Discord discussion/pics/small how-to: https://discord.com/channels/6479093974 ... 5471187007

Finally, some screenshots. Hope you find it useful :)

My Great Game - My Great Capture_2023-04-04_17-57-52.png
My Great Game - My Great Capture_2023-04-04_17-57-52.png (27.4 KiB) Viewed 6102 times
My Great Game - My Great Capture_2023-04-04_17-59-39.png
My Great Game - My Great Capture_2023-04-04_17-59-39.png (100.24 KiB) Viewed 6102 times
20230403_175137-screen.png
20230403_175137-screen.png (88.17 KiB) Viewed 6102 times
20230503_002105-screen.png
20230503_002105-screen.png (90.22 KiB) Viewed 6102 times
20230503_010523-screen.png
20230503_010523-screen.png (154.09 KiB) Viewed 6102 times
Post Reply